Listen now | This week on the pod, we’ve got writer Freddie deBoer joining us for a conversation about the fate of the Bernie movement, the bona fires of progressives in Washington, and the all-important question of how to relate to leftist electeds — especially when they stray from their professed principles.
Right? We have to do the impossible (convincing the existing system to undermine itself) so that we can do what is today impossible (fundamental change), and that’s why we shouldn’t try the impossible (challenging the duopoly from the outside).
Direct action is very possible. And it yields results. Kshama Sawant's record as a member of the Seattle City Council shows that victories are possible even within the system - if one is prepared to actually fight, not imitate the activity (read Sanders, AOC, etc.). Making tricky comments on the pages of YT millionaire tricksters, however, will hardly do the trick :)
I agree with you. Outside, direct action is the only viable path. By the time we’d get the system to reform itself, a measure like rank-choice voting would be superfluous.
oh dear lot's of things to unpack here. deboer is strawmanning the critics of the piece as 'worshippers'. While he is correct on critisizing some of her votes he strawmans them acting like e.g her present vote on the iron dome is the totallity of her actions when she has pushed amedments to condition aid and has voted against offensive aid and called israel an apartheid state on cnn. Moreover he completely ignores her local organizing in ny14 and nyc in general which is pivotal for dsa candidates as she endorses them and campaigns for them, she has also organized and uplifted many dsa campaigns like nongr, taxtheritch, public housing, build public renewables act has her campaign team bring groceries and backpacks to people and is organizing for street ventors and starbucks workers(deboer believes joe crowley would be helpfull and not at all hostile to dsa apparenly). Kyle also claims she castised dems for not supporting latinx which isn't true, she said hey don't focus on it focus on m4a economics etc(btw no mention by anyone that she passed in the house a pro mdma amedment in bipartisan passion). There are incosistences and bigger cooordination with progressive orgs like jdems, dsa and electeds is needed but if kyle wants that he should bring someone from jdems and dsa not a substack writter who is not part to any of these movements
Tbh it’s refreshing to listen to a critique of AOC! So much of it just feels so performative with her. I seriously think Washington will ultimately turn her into another HRC!
Krystal and Kyle. Why are you ignoring Jenn Dize’ story on the Marianne Williamson campaign? I think of you two as straight shooters so this is kinda sus to me. Jenn says she has reached out to you with the story and has heard nothing back. Her reporting seems pretty solid.
Kyle - you have about as much a chance of getting rank choice voting as you do getting a Green Party candidate in the white house
Right? We have to do the impossible (convincing the existing system to undermine itself) so that we can do what is today impossible (fundamental change), and that’s why we shouldn’t try the impossible (challenging the duopoly from the outside).
Direct action is very possible. And it yields results. Kshama Sawant's record as a member of the Seattle City Council shows that victories are possible even within the system - if one is prepared to actually fight, not imitate the activity (read Sanders, AOC, etc.). Making tricky comments on the pages of YT millionaire tricksters, however, will hardly do the trick :)
I agree with you. Outside, direct action is the only viable path. By the time we’d get the system to reform itself, a measure like rank-choice voting would be superfluous.
who are the "YT millionaire tricksters"?
oh dear lot's of things to unpack here. deboer is strawmanning the critics of the piece as 'worshippers'. While he is correct on critisizing some of her votes he strawmans them acting like e.g her present vote on the iron dome is the totallity of her actions when she has pushed amedments to condition aid and has voted against offensive aid and called israel an apartheid state on cnn. Moreover he completely ignores her local organizing in ny14 and nyc in general which is pivotal for dsa candidates as she endorses them and campaigns for them, she has also organized and uplifted many dsa campaigns like nongr, taxtheritch, public housing, build public renewables act has her campaign team bring groceries and backpacks to people and is organizing for street ventors and starbucks workers(deboer believes joe crowley would be helpfull and not at all hostile to dsa apparenly). Kyle also claims she castised dems for not supporting latinx which isn't true, she said hey don't focus on it focus on m4a economics etc(btw no mention by anyone that she passed in the house a pro mdma amedment in bipartisan passion). There are incosistences and bigger cooordination with progressive orgs like jdems, dsa and electeds is needed but if kyle wants that he should bring someone from jdems and dsa not a substack writter who is not part to any of these movements
Tbh it’s refreshing to listen to a critique of AOC! So much of it just feels so performative with her. I seriously think Washington will ultimately turn her into another HRC!
Kyle, if you keep doing what you have always done expect the same results
Krystal and Kyle. Why are you ignoring Jenn Dize’ story on the Marianne Williamson campaign? I think of you two as straight shooters so this is kinda sus to me. Jenn says she has reached out to you with the story and has heard nothing back. Her reporting seems pretty solid.