Episode 3: Thomas Frank

"Trumpism is older than Trump, and it will outlast him." How can we defeat it?

First off, we can’t thank you all enough for the remarkable response to the first 2 episodes of KK&F. We’ve been blown away. This is the last video episode that will be free here and on Kyle’s channel. So if you want to continue to get the video, subscribe below. The audio will always be free here on Substack and on all the normal podcasting platforms. Next week we have the incomparable Nina Turner on so you know you don’t want to miss that.

Talking with Thomas Frank

It’s hard to think of leftist writers who have had a greater influence on our thoughts and work than Thomas Frank. In this week’s episode, we sit down with Thomas to flesh out the story of how the Democrats abandoned working-class politics, how Republicans seized the populist narrative, and how Americans can look to a people-led political movement in our own past as a bulwark against Trumpism. Thomas is a leading voice on this topic, as he demonstrates in books from What’s the Matter with Kansas? to last year’s The People, No. We highly recommend getting your hands on a copy of these books, by the way, but first, watch our conversation about the history and right-wing co-opting of the Populist movement. As you’ll see, it’s a conversation made urgent by the times we’re living through.

Following news coverage of the Capitol riot, you’ve probably wondered why liberal outlets have insisted on painting the right-wing mob as “populist.” Thomas Frank has answers. Key figures of Democratic leadership have displayed what he calls a “lack of faith in ordinary Americans” for decades, right down to Hillary Clinton’s support for Reaganite policies and ideas in her 2016 run for the presidency. On the opposite side of the aisle, the outlook for working-class politics is equally bleak. Republican elites openly embrace the gutting of social support systems and the oppression of labor. The Trumpian maneuver is to channel legitimate grievance into endless culture war. Democrats play easily into their hands by centering their party around scolding ordinary people.

So when liberal commentators refer to those storming the Capitol as “populist,” they’re making the case that anyone who cares about working-class politics must be a violent Trumpist mob. They’re using the Trump mob to indict all working people and to crush the core populist idea that ordinary people should have power and a say in governance. Because if populism is a violent delusional mob, better let the credentialed experts and elite class handle the important work of governance. This in spite of the fact that the past decade has seen nothing but a non-stop cascade of elite failure.

As Thomas argues in his own work, building a strong American left from the lessons and legacy of the Populist movement is precisely what we need to do in the present. Like the Populists fought for multiracial working-class solidarity and economic security in their time, we have a mandate to take up these struggles today in order to defeat Trumpism — which, as Thomas points out, didn’t start with Trump and won’t end with him. In fact, if we allow the Democratic Party, which is supposed to be the party of the people, to continue down the path of moralizing self-righteousness and elite credentialed anti-populism, the next Trump will have all the fodder they need to do even more damage.

Watch Episode Three of Krystal Kyle & Friends below and share if you like it.

Tomorrow it will be available on all major streaming platforms, including Spotify, Stitcher, Google Podcasts, and Apple Podcasts.